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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 7, 2022 19:20:03 GMT
So now that the new year has started, we've begun our search for a match. As expected, Linkmaker is a lot and I know it may take quite some time. So I'd love to hear what it was that drew you to your little one/s. Looking for a little insight and perhaps some joy too.
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Post by leo on Jan 9, 2022 22:34:08 GMT
Hello, things were a little different back when I adopted and there didn't appear to be as much 'choice' - although I'm uncomfortable with using that word.
For me I think it was important to make a practical choice so that element came first. Partly that was led by a very real fear that no social worker would ever choose me for 'their' children so I couldn't let myself invest emotions too early.
During home study (as it was called then), my social worker showed me a one page profile of 2 siblings and asked my opinion on whether they would be a match for me. I had an inkling she thought they might be - but I said no (at which a friend of mine was aghast, fearful I would never be offered another child - she herself fell into that mistake and adopted the first child she was shown the profile for despite recognising both then and now that she wasn't a good match for the child).
My reasoning was that one child had a medical issue (which was perfectly manageable and within my experience) that would require fairly regular hospital appointments. As a single parent, I would have been constantly either dragging the sibling with me or arranging childcare for them and leaving them whilst I focused on their sibling. That didn't feel fair or right to me when I knew these would be children with attachment and trust issues.
My social worker accepted my reasoning after a few questions - but soon after approval returned to me saying their social worker was trying very hard to at least give me more information/ meet with me. I stood my ground because it just didn't feel right. (I had close experience of a similar situation and the 'healthy' sibling developed many long term emotional and mental health issues.)
Then, about 3 months after approval I saw a pair of siblings in a National magazine and after several months of exchanges of information (things were so slow) we went as far as having a matching panel date set. I felt no emotional connection to the children as such, it was more a case of, 'they don't feel wrong' and I thought I could meet their needs. Unfortunately a couple of rather major life events in my family meant I was taken off the approved list and put on hold. I never heard from their social worker again and it was agony. Looking back, I realise I was heading into that match pretty blind. I'd had very little information about them and never even met their social worker, it was all email or over the phone.
A year went by. I was re-approved/taken off hold and by then my LA were sending out a quarterly booklet of children waiting for adoption.
My social worker rang and left a message at home saying she had seen siblings (in the LA booklet) who may be a match. On the same day, I rang and left her a message from work saying I had seen siblings in the National magazine that I'd like more information about. They were the same children. They were Tsunami and Hurricane.
Initially, it was again more a, 'Well, I think I could meet their needs' and, 'They don't feel 'wrong''. The information given initially was 2 sentences about each child and it was over 2 years out of date so my social worker requested more up to date information - but was told by their family finder that the national search had provided 7 possible families for these children already and that they felt 2 parents would be better than 1.
Bless her, my social worker pushed and insisted the family finder read my PAR - upon which she became a little more interested and set a date to meet me. I received their CPRs but amongst the 70 odd pages of each there was barely two short paragraphs actually about the child and that was considerably out of date.
I very much felt it was me being selected for the children rather than me having any particular connection to them or their profiles. That was ok with me - although I did push for a lot more information (which was very slow to arrive).
By the time I met with their family finder (their social worker was also due at the meeting but failed to turn up), I knew nothing more than those 2 short paragraphs on each. Still it was more about me feeling I could potentially meet their needs rather than anything else. I was told before the meeting that there were 4 other possible families still in the mix and any decision would be a while. I did ask questions during the meeting but mostly the family finder didn't know the answers as she had only met the children once by then. I was heavily questioned. A full on, real interview.
I was deflated and exhausted as they left, but as I closed my front door I overheard the family finder tell my social worker she thought she had just met Hurricane and Tsunami's new Mum. I bounced around like an idiot behind the door and that was probably the first time I let myself believe it might happen. There still wasn't any connection to the children as individuals though, more just a step ticked off in the process.
Wheels moved very slowly (despite me being told social services were desperate to remove the boys from their current foster carers).
Whilst the 70 pages of the CPR were useless in telling me about the children, they did hint at other paperwork, assessments etc and my social worker requested over 30 other documents for me.
The first time I felt an emotional connection was when I read a clinical psychologist's report (again, over 2 years old) about Tsunami. Reading about a young child with so much trauma, so many different placements and so many mistakes made by social services brought out my protective instinct. The psychologist described a child of three (at the time of writing) with disorganised attachment who had the speech and language of an 8 month old, the physical ability of a 15 month old and an emotional understanding/connection level lower than the lowest rating (of 6 months) - but the bit that really pulled me in was when in the summary she made the comment that this was a child for whom there had been no anchor, no-one who understood him and no-one to champion his needs. I felt such a visceral pull towards him at the pit of my stomach. It was that moment I vowed to be his anchor.
For Hurricane, strangely it took much longer despite an almost carbon copy psychologist report - perhaps significantly missing the anchor comment though. For him, it was the day before matching panel when the family finder came and showed me a short video clip she had taken that day during a break in some preparation work she had been doing with them. The boys had been given a snack to eat and while the family finder turned away to reach for the drinks she had prepared, Hurricane, quick as a flash, stole his brother's snack and shoved it in his mouth in one fell swoop. Tsunami didn't react (and didn't that tell its own story of their sibling relationship) but the family finder realised and challenged Hurricane about it. Hurricane swore blind (and boy did he swear despite significant speech issues) he hadn't touched it - whilst very obviously struggling to talk through the enormous quantity of food in his mouth. I have always been a bit of a sucker for a naughty boy and that was me, hooked right at that moment.
The video clip ended with Hurricane spitting out the very chewed remains of the snack onto his hand and Tsunami licking it off. I really should have paid more attention to this. The sibling dynamic and the food issues may not have been such a shock if I had!
For me it was probably at least 6 months of them being home before I would have said I loved them or felt more than a very inept childminder. Before that I definitely felt a commitment to them, but love was much later for me - and significantly later still for them.
Gosh I've waffled! Sorry. Everybody is different and I think you just need to accept that you and your husband may approach matching in completely different ways - and a connection may catch you by surprise.
Be open and honest with yourselves, ask yourself if you can see you meeting their needs when they are 5, 15, 25 ... Project forward and try to imagine what a behaviour described now may look like at each of those ages - and whether you could (or want to) cope with that.
Over ten years later, my connection to Tsunami is still a visceral one; he still pulls at my stomach in a powerful and deep way whenever life is tough for him. Hurricane is still connected by his love of food and his cheeky wide eyed declarations of innocence (thankfully involving less swearing!)
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Post by moo on Jan 10, 2022 9:30:14 GMT
WoW leo an amazing post, I am feeling guilty as I see my reply has vanished?
My story is similar in as much back then single adopters by most ff & children's sw were not as attractive as couples?! They strove for a conventional family unit... Only exceptions were if splitting was predicted?!
Like leo I recollect with much amusement a ff & child's sw meeting I was coerced into (later ss confessed they were under pressure to interview as many prospective adopters as possible to secure the best match as previous one had broken down after placement ð) I intially said 'no' to the link giving reasons but was told it was not acceptable & if I wanted to progress it was expected that I comply!!! ð
The amusement is because toward the end of the meeting the child's sw said " So X has an issue with mud & gets anxious if muddy or dirty, how will you manage that? " I let rip in no uncertain terms & replied " Ha this is a working farm, cow p00 is far the bigger issue mud is the least of it & why exactly have you considered this a match knowing the farms status, where BTW is this anxiety detailed on his permanent report? ( it wasn't) I closed the meeting at that point stating that I felt it an inappropriate natch & waste of time... You can imagine I was for the high jump & my sw boss was rushed around to lecture me on the appropriate way to meet future sw ?!?. ð ðŋ ð ðŋ
Suffice to say all those very many years ago things were very different ( I hope) to how they are today... my sw was as much use as the proverbial chocolate teapot & was regularly referred to by me as my pet demon...Things only improved when I met the boys sw & from that moment on life turned the corner I dreamed it would she was professional & clearly wanted the best outcome for her charges & immediately saw the pet demon for what she was & took over proper sw support for me as well as them, she to this day remains the best & greatest highlight of my loooong wait between panels....
So sorry I waffle back to answer your Q..
It hinges on the tick box section of your report " what do you feel most confident to parent" know yourself & dh & the strengths you jointly bring... remember there will be many shocks & many non disclosures about the child/ren past & behaviours. I cannot imagine that will have changed ss are very good at being reserved in sharing all pertinent child history info.... Be sure to read between the lines to know what to expect it is often what is NOT said that tells the bigger story.. research buzz words & their real meaning weather hinted or real diagnosed...
As a working farmer mud & cow p00 is a real dact of life so boys were my best choice for success ( I wanted 1 to 2 at placement so a girl showing tomboy tendencies at this age seemed highly unlikely..).. tractors are obviously magical, but only to boys really!! ðĪŠ ð so I took much flak from my pet demon for daring to have a preference & she spent every waking moment trying to talk me into a girl really ð......
As soon as I saw my boys placement report I did get that pull, it is hard to know why tbh I guess as falling in love you never really know why them?? One of my best memories was meeting the boys wonderful sw for the first time here on the farm as expected the pet demon tried to 'run' the meeting but the boys sw soon was clear she wanted My Answers & input only.... she said how delighted she was as all was as she imagined reading all my info & she could 'see' the boys running around happily... Other families were to be visited she said as she left but she gave me a massive wink....Pet demon said it would be a fortnight before I heard but...... sw saw her boss that night fought for me without other parent meetings & called the very next day to say we were matched emailed to pet demon.... From there it was a wonderful working to matching panel & move in forever day....
Happy Happy Memories... as time passed every visit from her when boys placed were a joy her support was amazing.... Boys & I have never looked back & I am lucky to be able to say it was love at first sight.... Full on issues a plenty but all I ever hoped & dreamed motherhood could be.... sw said she too got the vibe immediately she met me... Boys were a long case for her & she totally wanted the very best chance for them she knew them sooo well & said she just knew which is why she for the first & only time in her career did not need to see the 2nd & 3 rd choice family options....
Would I do it all over..... in a heartbeat.... has it been tuff... deffo.... would I recommed it.... sure thing ð ð don't think life will ever be the same tho it is tottally 100% full on high-speed don't forget your seat belt & crash helmet ð stuff
Enjoy the ride your child/ren are out there waiting for you ....
I was a year between panels... Hth
Xx moo xx
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 10, 2022 20:46:54 GMT
Wow guys! Thank you so much for these responses. It's given me a lot to base my thinking on, and I will post more. But first off just wanted to say thank you!! These insights are so helpful and I really appreciate you sharing such special memories.
I do think just at the moment I have an info overload/processing problem.
We've reviewed something like 100 profiles. Expressed interest in 5, had expressions of interest in us from 2 more, and currently got 3 potential discussions running already (and its only been a week and a half!!) It's our SW who is saying take it steady. Then we got our first CPR through today and I have only skimmed the first half. I know I'm only taking in surface level at the moment, and need to think through what we can really manage. I find that tough because we don't have kids already. So I know what I think we can manage but......
I know the above is a good point to be at viewed objectively. But it's alot all at once.
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Post by leo on Jan 10, 2022 21:44:20 GMT
Oh my word, no wonder you feel overwhelmed. That's a huge amount of profiles!
I think the Adoption UK magazine came out monthly and that only had maybe 20 or so mini profiles (maybe more,I honestly can't remember). The LA one was only every 3 months with maybe 5 to 10. I think Linkmaker has really changed how many profiles people see.
My social worker was keen for me to only express interest in one sibling group at a time. I think partly that was because she knew I would get overwhelmed and partly a belief that to make a sensible decision I needed to focus rather than have a more scattered approach. It took longer, but I'd waited so long to be a parent I wasn't going to risk making bad choices just for the sake of speed.
Is there a way you can streamline the amount of information you are trying to absorb? Could you initially split all profiles and information so you and your husband look at half each?
Take your time, don't rush yourself or allow others to rush you, this is a massive decision. Missing a month or two of your child's life now to ensure you have enough information and can make an informed decision will not even register in five years time.
Would it help for someone to challenge you on your 'criteria' or what your strengths and possible weaknesses are to help you focus? My best friend did this for me with each profile I looked at and it pushed me to justify my reasoning and therefore helped me to make decisions.
Wishing you good luck for this part of the process.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 10, 2022 22:47:11 GMT
Thanks Leo! I think our SW will support us to take our time. (Moo's pet daemon made me laugh though!).
I like the idea of getting people to challenge us for justifications. We will definitely use that.
I hope reviewing the huge number of profiles is behind us now. We ended up with an initial long list of 30, and our FF kindly cut that in half by underlying things she thought may be too much. Then from that 15 we got our first 5.
Because Linkmaker has made expressing interest so quick, we've been warned you have to put alot of requests out there to get anything back. So we didn't expect things to develop so quickly. We were also told there were too many adopters at the moment, so no one would approach us; but again that isn't quite the case for us yet.
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Post by moo on Jan 11, 2022 11:14:55 GMT
Wow oh Wow... so much so fffast......like leo things for me were very slooow.... plus as a in County only match was allowed by my la it was even slower....
Aggree with Leo be very fierce with yourself about your strengths & best chance for which l/o you can be the best for xx
Wishing you lots of luck try to enjoy yourselves this really is the good bit? ð
Thinking of you.... Thanx for bringing all those long ago wonderful memories to the surface...
Xx moo ðŪ
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Post by gilreth on Jan 11, 2022 18:36:47 GMT
Our story was somewhat different in that we now know we had been identified as a possible match for our 10yo 2-3 months before we were approached - his family finder had been the social worker who had done all the initial work with us on applying to adopt but had then had to pull away once she had recommended us forward to do the prep course as she and my husband realised they had known each other at university (have a good friend in common) - penalty of living where you studied. I suspect we may have seen his profile a month or so before we did if I had not had a difficult start to June. Anyway our social worker shocked us about 3 weeks before approval panel to ask if she could come to talk to us with some profiles. So 5 days before we were actually at panel we talked through a couple of children's profiles and then said yes we wanted to look further at one which was jumping out at us. We had a long hard discussion and read but it came back to that immediate reaction we had both had when our SW was describing the little boy. We had asked for CPRs without photos so it was all done based on what was written there. So on the morning of approval panel we told our SW we wanted to move forward - at the time it was non competitive matching where we lived so we were only family in frame. We met nearly a month later on a Friday with his SW (and ours but not family finder as she was on holiday - this was late August) and the match was confirmed on the Tuesday (BH Monday). So we went to that aforementioned friends wedding (technically a civil partnership still at time) with photos to show our small group of friends. Little did we know on the day of the wedding that a month later we would be at approval panel and 6 weeks after that wedding our son moved in - it all happened very fast (good reason as otherwise would have had to be post Christmas).
I have rambled a bit but that little boy is now in year 6 and thriving. Very much our son and we have never regretted that initial leap of faith. We really did feel he was right for us.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 11, 2022 20:52:07 GMT
Thank you all for sharing.
It really is THE leap of faith, isn't it.
We've got lots of info, a fair bit of which is quite or very negative. And despite all that I do feel the startings of potential conncetions. I'm trying to really keep it in proportion because it is so early and these things cannot be briahed away. And Mr Bear is generally more considered and really I don't want to rush ahead.
Gilreth, can I ask if the CPR was challenging in places and how did you work through that in light of the connection feeling? Totally appreciate if you'd rather not say.
The excitement is coming too; but I spent all last year not getting my hopes up so it's a hard habit to shake!
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Post by gilreth on Jan 11, 2022 21:00:01 GMT
CPR was challenging in terms of reasons our son was in care which is proving a difficult and drawn out explanation due to need for maturity for him to understand it. Only major concerns it raised with him were his in utereo experience and how long he had been in care (nearly 2 years from birth) and why this was the case. Long story as to why but he wouldn't be our son if it hadn't happened. His story in somewhat different to the majority of kids locally as there were a lot from substance misuse backgrounds but as my husband worked at the time as pharmacist in inner city (and watched kids being removed) we knew that we would not end up with a kid from that background due to risks.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 11, 2022 22:05:57 GMT
Thank you. Length of time in care and number of foster carers/moves it quite a reoccurring theme at the moment.
While our appproved age range is 0 to 6, our preference was always more 2 to 6, and we're finding ourselves drawn more to the 5 and 6 year olds. But that naturally comes with more disruption.
How many moves had yoy child/ren had? Is that playing out in their/your later life?
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Post by flutterby on Jan 12, 2022 7:50:30 GMT
I was hesitant whether I should reply as I did not want to come across as too doom and gloom. I am very aware that our experience is not one anyone would want to strive for.
A child who is 5 or 6 but had a good first couple of years and then things started to unravel will in all likelihood have fewer issues. At least they would have the important building blocks for attachment and the knowledge that life can be good.
Lots of moves, particularly in the first year, are a huge concern.
Read the CPRs and keep asking yourself, what are they not telling me? Are there any "throw away" remarks? They are legally only allowed to put info pertinent to your own child in there. So if there is mention in the chronology of older children and their birth dads, why is that important for you to know? e.g. previous birth dads were pedophiles, were involved in drug rings.
This is likely to mean that your child would have been exposed/victim of this as well, only SS were unable to get proof. They would have still known about it. But they would not necessarily say anything to you.
With an older child more is known and it is easier to get long-term support agreed before adoption.
Sorry, you wanted to know what drew us to our child. We had birth children and we did not want our new child to stand out as being adopted. No-one would ever know, in fact when we arrived at the foster carer's she thought we must be extended family.
Our CPR did not mention all the moves otherwise this would have been a concern. They glossed over them because the children "only" went to respite foster carers 2-3 weeks at a time. Try and reason this out with a baby. I only found out through the foster carers notes. But by the time I got to read them the adoption order had gone through.
Our CPR just did not sound that bad. Yes, there were issues, but they could have been far worse. And they were! But again, we only had proof years later.
We felt drawn to our child, no doubt about it. It was also an in-house match which we thought would give a certain amount of protection against being lied to. We could not have been more wrong.
We were drawn to our child because we had been given incomplete and misleading information. And received the wrong advice. All in-house. So keep asking questions, ask for support to be written into the adoption order.
Our child and her siblings were failed so badly by the very people who should have helped them. So please don't just believe everything SS say or that the CPR will cover all the important information.
So sorry to be scaremongering. I remember the excitement at the time. Being drawn to a profile, imagining this could be my child. It was a magical, emotional time.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 12, 2022 20:45:37 GMT
Thanks Flutterby. I do appreciate the frank advice from all quarters is exactly what I need right now.
I'll make sure to ask about how much respite stays any possible match has had. And I'm definitely going to be pushing for identified needs to be covered in the adoption order.
Unfortunately it's a common theme that children's SWs are economical with the truth at the very least. So we intend to treat everything with caution on that front. I do have a little more confidence with our SW & FF because PACT are a VA. No chance of an in house match and if we are successfully matched we get support from them going forward. So far they've been cautioning us against possibilities. But will keep my eyes open and keep questioning.
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Post by leo on Jan 14, 2022 0:41:17 GMT
Flutterby raises good points. Becoming a master at reading between the lines is essential.
'Hurricane is a cheeky smiley little boy, and has a strong determination and personality. He can sometimes struggle with his balance and co-ordination but is still very physically active.'Â Â
These were the two sentences (on a complete CPR) about one of my children. Translation...
'Hurricane continues to smile whilst he is being physically aggressive and verbally rude; he is a force to be reckoned with, stubborn as an ox and will continue to do exactly as he pleases when he pleases with no regard for his or anyone else's safety or welfare or for any consequences there may be. Despite hardly being able to see (because nobody has bothered to make him wear his glasses - which have only just been prescribed because, well, see earlier part of statement) and having poor body control across the areas of gross motor skills, fine motor skills (because no one has ever noticed his disfigured fingers and toes) and toileting, Hurricane never stops moving and doesn't sleep for more than 30 minutes at a time.'
Another good point is about respite care and moves. On their initial paperwork, it looked as though my children had only had 4 Foster Carers (which already seemed plenty). Actually they'd had more than 10 - and had been in and out of respite, both when with birth family and then when in Foster Care, over 100 times. They had quite literally no understanding of permanence or of relationships - and the damage that has caused them is significant and will never be fully repaired. To answer your question, yes, the number of moves has had a direct and devastating impact on their ability to form and maintain relationships.Â
If you start to pursue a link (in my day you expressed an interest and had some info, then social workers met together and decided you could be 'linked', then more info and meetings before approaching matching panel for the official match), I would recommend asking for Foster Carer logs, social worker visit notes, copies of the statutory medical reviews, copies of the previous LAC meetings, copies of any other professional reports that may have been written, nursery school reports ... information really is key. Ask to meet with as many people involved in the child's life as possible; it helps to develop a more rounded picture of the child and also to bring them to life a little.
It is a tricky time and even when you find the right match you will still be a little unsure and nervous; that's natural and healthy. I hope your social worker guides you well.
Also, re support - it can be really helpful to give yourselves more than the ? 10 ? weeks of placement necessary to apply for the adoption order. You will need time to adjust and judge for yourselves what types of support you may need. I thought being offered 20 sessions of attachment focussed therapy before matching panel was amazing - until my children had lived with me for a few months and we were a couple of sessions in. I then realised we needed far, far more. It may be helpful to research different therapeutic approaches and what situations and behaviours they are most suited for while you have the time to do so without the pressure of being in a state of need. Think about what sort of style matches you and your husband as well because you will need to be a part of it and there will be little progress made if you are too uncomfortable to freely join in an art therapy session or dance movement... (learned this one from bitter experience!)
Lastly, a practical tip to make it feel you are doing something useful in this time of limbo - start to add in one or two of the more expensive household items to your shopping each week - shampoo, toilet rolls, washing powder. When one of you is either off work completely or on adoption pay, money can start getting a bit tight so it is useful to have a good stock of some items. It also helps when, as often happens in the early months of placement, you just seem to completely lose all ability to do normal things like write a sensible shopping list.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 14, 2022 21:11:11 GMT
Brilliant. Thank you Leo. That's all so useful.
Mr Bear will love the shopping tip (Yorkahireman) and I'm pretty sure he won't want to do dance therapy sessions (although I may enjoy watching him try!).
I'm going to sit down tomorrow and properly read my first CPR. Your illustration of SW speak will definitely help me zone in.
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Post by serrakunda on Jan 15, 2022 11:26:11 GMT
My SW turned up one day with a sheaf of profiles, I was very popular with family finders as I was clear I was looking for a school age child.
Simba was the second one. I took one look at him and thought its you, I'm your mum. On the surface he was everything I thought wasnt a great idea for me, parricularly having learning difficulties and ASD. And I thought they won't pursue it because he's black and I'm white. So I put him at the bottom of the pile. But kept coming back to him
So I asked for the CPR, it was truly dreadful and I thought I can't do this, but then I noticed that it was a over a year put of date (he had been with FC three years at that point). So I asked for an update which took several months. It was like reading about a different child, he had made so much progress. That was the key thing for me, the knowledge that he could progress.
The rest as they say is history ! But we were lucky I think. I had such a strong reaction to the photo that it was difficult to stand back and look at him objectively.
Agree totally with interpreting SW speak.
Alsp try not to think about information as negative. Its information, its who that child is, their reality, their challenges. What you have to decide is which challenges you can meet. And its ok to say I can't do this.
Interestingly, I thought one thing I woud struggle with was a non verbal child. Simba never shuts up, but was electively mute the first year in FC - the power of stabilty and care to turn things around.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 15, 2022 21:58:56 GMT
Having read my first CPR today that resonates a lot Serrakunda. When I skimmed it the other day (just before posting thread) the the stark reality of it was a lot to process.
It sounds really daft but I hadn't been expecting pictures of BM and BD. The contrast between those and the words was a shock.
But when I picked it up again today, I really dwelt on what it said about the child (and what it was saying between the lines). This thread has helped immensely to focus on the actually important bits.
I feel a little more confident about working my way through this decision.
Next step is to see what Mr Bear thinks. We've agreed to read CPRs separately at first. So as not to influence each others reactions and really learn for ourselves what are cannot dos are.
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Post by moo on Jan 16, 2022 8:54:33 GMT
Loving your updates... Great idea to read separately.....
Having photos sounds cool.... I didn't even see photos of boys until after matched!.!..... only saw BP when life story files finalised after AO... ( did meet bm tho a month after placement ) seeing photos must make it easier to visualise yourselves as a family .....
The time flies so fast, still amazed it has gone in a heartbeat mine are children no longer ð...I admire adopters who choose school aged children at placement because they are often only 3-5 years off hitting teenage angst!..... not so cuddly demanding bedtime stories anymore ð .....
Wishing you happy searching.... do post if you need help translating sw cpr veiled half hidden description of behaviours/ medical/emotional issues xx
Xx moo ðŪ
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Post by mudlark on Jan 21, 2022 23:47:01 GMT
Wow , so many amazing replies and insights - someone needs to put them all in a book for potential adopters!
The biggest challenge is that our two had too many moves in foster care. They came to us aged 3 and 4 and had already had 8 moves - that has caused so much damage - we are still working through it nearly nine years on - it is something to be aware of.
When we started out we looked at 100's of photos and profiles in two magazine type publications that were around at the time but were drawn to the photo, or the look in, our now daughters, face, I sensed her intelligence and sensitivity, our son, I just saw a little boy who needed a mummy very clearly. We did want a boy and a girl aged between 3 and 7 ish
And 9 years on that is all true - just mix in a whole load of other nightmarish, unsafe behaviour, unresolved trauma plus a dollop of sweet and very kind nature, loving and compassionate from our daughter and a fireball of anger from our son which erupts now and again - but mainly he is the most loving and loyal son you could ever imagine!
I look back and see the connection t - but I am a 'rescuer' by nature - I have since learned you cannot rescue, only provide all the tools, all the emotional scaffolding, including love, and they may come through. Mine are finding it rather an assault course, Actually so am I.
The very best to you.
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Post by flutterby on Jan 22, 2022 12:16:09 GMT
Mudlark, your comment about moves resonated with me. Sometimes, I wonder whether the thinking around moves does not need to be reframed and turned on its head.
We need to ask the question, was the trauma caused by the moves or was there already so much damage that none of the foster carers could cope?
In which case the moves become a byproduct of additional trauma heaped on the poor child rather than being the cause.
That the system not only failed to spot (or turned a blind eye to) how damaged the children already were and then merrily allowed unwitting adopters to take on children who simply cannot thrive in a home environment unless a huge of support and therapy is put in place long-term from the start. And some may just not be able to cope with family life full stop.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 22, 2022 20:24:31 GMT
Thanks Mudlark! Everyone has been very generous with their time, memories and advice on this thread.
I wanted to ask you if a child who had had a lot of moves would be a reason to say no if you were adopting again?
We're looking at a little one who has had 5 so far. It's probably the main major concern. He's attached very well to his last two sets of FCs; and has been with his current ones for 2 years. But that will make the move to adoptive parents all the bigger.
I'm assuming for now there would be quite a lot of behavioural regression when he moves to adoptive parents. And the further disruption to his world means no guarantees for attachment going forward. I'm also fully intending to probe and see how much respite stays there have been etc.
But putting the above aside, I can good synergies between what he needs from parents and what we have to offer.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 22, 2022 20:30:47 GMT
Thank you Flutterby; I only properly saw your reply to Mudlark after I'd posted my reply to her.
I think your point is a key one, and certainly something I'd want to explore re the little one we're looking at now.
The moves he's had within care to date don't seem to stem soley from his behaviours or an inability to cope within a family. But they were a factor in him leaving his initial foster placement. And we haven't yet had an opportunity to check about respite stays. That I will definitely be asking about.
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Post by leo on Jan 23, 2022 8:02:39 GMT
I'd not necessarily be put off, even knowing what I know now, but I would be questioning the reasons for the moves and how they were handled ... mine had one particularly traumatic sudden foster care move and it has had a huge impact.
Think about how you would help him understand this isn't just another foster care move. I made a terrible mistake a couple of months into placement relating to a family member we had slowly been seeing more of who then looked after them while I had a review meeting. Tsunami asked me when they would be moving to their new Daddy's house. It was a cruel reminder of the many moves and how little he understood what was going on.
I would also very much be questioning what this attachment with the last 2 carers actually looks and feels like. Is it natural to attach yourself when you've had many moves? Is it panic/keeping them close? Is it over compliance? Is it a very good outside image but with no actual feelings? Dig into it and try to get a feel for what's going on.
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Post by moo on Jan 23, 2022 9:31:10 GMT
My 2 were lucky no moves in f/c BUT....they did not have a good experience.... baa in particular was very challenging & active ( note the sw speak!!) & f/c just could not handle him therapeutically...
I was very anxious especially when we met & I had to tolerate her behaviour toward the boys during intro's..... However it caused a very unexpected real positive bonding advantage for us as a family once intro's & move in day happened.... looking back I am astounded but it really helped baa move on... something at the time I found disturbing... He couldn't wait to move in with his new mummeee & new home... I believed sw that he was too young to understand & Mummy was just a word according to sw... but no baa got it he knew f/c deeply disliked him & was unkind to him ( withheld food & ate chocolate in front of him refusing to allow him any).... Really.... I witnessed it she found it 'fun' to watch his meltdown.... ð ðŋ But he did not grieve leaving f/c & I was worried this was a bad sign....
It took time but it enabled me to very easily have 'chats' about lifestory work, forever family & his life ahead & mummee's love for him & skweek, when he often asked Q's as he did regularly, as he tried to understand why I was different to bf & f/c..... It was a polar opposite to the huge worry I had about f/c.... ( boys sw was v alarmed when I reported f/c managment of boys) Reported to ss but low f/c in County meant she slipped thro the net & continued albeit heavily monitored ðĨ ðŋ ðĨ
Baa was very young but his survival instinct was obviously massive ( he looked out for skweek too) & he to this day can 'read' expressions that even I do not spot in people he meets.... it deeply saddens me that he had to learn this while being abused as a baby & toddler it so explains his early behaviours...
Trust your gut mrsbear21 but look closely at sw speak, challenge & ask Q's constantly.... sw want to see you are engaged & committed it will help convince them & you may even get the best chance with having the real picture of the l/ o you are considering.....
Loving the updates please keep posting xx
Xx moo ðŪ
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 23, 2022 21:11:37 GMT
Thank you Moo & Leo. Mr Bear and I have decided we're going to keep pursing conversations on this little one. It's so helpful to have your questions and experience in our minds as we progress.
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Post by gilreth on Jan 29, 2022 12:59:03 GMT
Asking about moves was something that we were very aware off. But our son had been in one placement up to 5 weeks old (after a week in hospital) and then was with the same foster carer till he was placed with us. Unfortunately we now realise some of his issues stem from the fact that from when he was a year old the FC had two siblings back with her (on long term as our son was last short-term) who she had had previous to him and whose adoption had broken down (before AO point). This made for a very busy household so our son had to fight for attention and his attachment issues and need for every adult to like him stem from then.
We did ask about respite - and he had been in it with the same carer (who he met at other times) for 2 weeks in 2 years. He had also been looked after by family of FC in her home for another 2 weeks. The major reason it all went so fast for us was to avoid respite as FC had booked Disneyland Paris holiday at half term with her 2 older foster children not expecting our son to still be with her.
So from this it is very much worthwhile considering the household as well - of the three adopted children in my family only the youngest has minimal attachment issues as he was in foster care by himself with no respite from birth. My older nephew has real issues thanks to an even busier foster care placement than my son.
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Post by mrsbear21 on Jan 30, 2022 21:24:10 GMT
Thank you Gilreth. That's also a really good point to consider, and I'll be sure to ask.
Do we collectively think weekend respite twice a month (albeit always with the same respite carer) sounds like a lot? It does to me. Technically this was two years ago because since Covid there hasn't been any; but LA has been funding after school/holiday clubs. Even further back LA describes respite as regular....
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Post by moo on Jan 31, 2022 8:03:16 GMT
Perhaps ask for an updated cpr.... Good idea as covid will have changed routines & therefore behaviours.... Might be simply to give f/c respite...... boys f/c needed it as she wouldn't therapeutically parent....
Ask for clarification changes in presentation of behaviours since cpr initially typed...
Good Luck......
Xx moo ðŪ
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Post by mrsbear21 on Feb 1, 2022 21:26:02 GMT
Thanks Moo! Good thoughts
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Post by leo on Feb 1, 2022 22:42:39 GMT
I certainly think twice a month in respite is an awful lot! Assuming we are talking about either a pre-verbal or only just verbal child (given you are talking of 2 years ago), how on earth would they be able to understand what was going on? I do honestly think their attachment must have been truly nobbled and you need to dig deeper into the reasons for this level of respite and the behaviours exhibited both in respite and then once back 'home'.
I met with the most recent set of respite carers for my boys. They had met them 3 times by then - the first time being when they picked them up from school on a Friday night to take home for the weekend (without their 'normal' FC present; they took suitcases with them to school on the Friday morning and were dropped back off there on the Monday morning). They proudly described how very happy and loving Tsunami was; how he snuggled up next to them on the sofa while watching TV and how he gave them kisses and hugs at bedtime. They really were lovely people - but they had no idea at all about what those actions of Tsunami's meant for his understanding of and ability to form meaningful relationships. In over 10 years, I have never had a bedtime kiss from him and only recently will he even lean onto my shoulder when he wants some comfort.
I also would be questioning the need (and suitability of) breakfast and after school club - why is the child attending these when they presumably need extra sensitive and attuned parenting - not group childcare where their needs will be diluted amongst many others. It would make me question again that assertion that the child has a very good attachment with the current foster carers. Is their only way of managing the level of need by minimising the amount of time the child is in the house? What nurture is this child receiving - and from who? It seems they have Foster carers, respite carers, before school 'carers', school staff, after school 'carers ... that's an awful lot of people for a traumatised child to be coping with. Where is the continuity of care - even just in how many different approaches there will be to snack times for example.
I am by no means saying 'walk away' (it would be rather hypocritical of me for a start), but any information you can get now to help you understand what is driving behaviours and feelings will be hugely useful; it could also help you form a strong case for ongoing support or therapy once placed. Time spent investigating this now when you have the time and energy to ask questions, to reflect, thinking through together the impact these details you are discovering will have had (and continue to have) for 'your' child, to question yourselves on how you would approach this/what your feelings are about it, will be time well spent.
Has this child ever had any formal assessment - of attachment, of abilities, of behaviours - by either a psychologist or therapist? I would not have known about a very detailed and informative assessment undertaken by a clinical psychologist if I hadn't questioned who a Dr. X was in the cc list at the bottom of a letter setting a time for LAC review (that had accidentally been photocopied and sent to me with some other information I had requested).
Foster carer logs can give an indication of what a typical week looks like - I only had a few given to me but they told a story of a hectic/chaotic lifestyle with many major 'events' (big days out and holidays) that I wouldn't have even coped with myself. They needed time on their own, at home, not being dragged all over the place - but both their social worker and the FC were adamant the children 'loved' it and it was actually written into our introduction plan that we should be meeting family and 'doing things' right from the very start. By Day 2 of intros, both my SW and myself knew this was not a sensible choice and changes were made - although sadly not enough and I still feel guilty about how overwhelming and scary it all was for them.
It sounds as if you feel a connection to this child so I really hope you can get as much information as possible and can move forwards. Good luck.
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