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Post by bagpuss72 on Nov 15, 2013 13:21:12 GMT
Bert is described as a complex child, but we do not have any formal DX as yet, apart from a visual impairment since birth. We finally had a successful referral to camhs last year at 6.5 yrs. of age. He has been having Theraplay on/off over the last year which camhs insisted on before they would start Play therapy with him. The theraplay has been helpful and 6.5 years after placement he is finally letting us in to parent him and is accepting me as his mum, some of the time anyway. Other professionals believe he has traits of ADHD, ODD, OCD and ASD together with an anxious, hyper-vigilant, controlling, avoidant attachment disorder. FAE is also a consideration. School see nothing wrong apparently, PA SWs, therapists and camhs have all been trying to get school to accept Bert has complex needs. His teacher is the senco and deputy head. We desperately want to move schools, but having some sort of diagnosis would help us decide on the right school for his needs. We are also in the three tier school system so next September will be in year 4 then moving up to middle school. Unless things improve dramatically he will never be ready to cope with different classrooms and responsibility for his time table etc. He is also in a mixed year 3 and 4 class which just doesn’t work for Bert.
He has been having play therapy at camhs for 2 months now and has just had an assessment with the clinical psychologist. His specialist therapist has said from the start that attachment problems of some sort were almost a given with his history, but ADHD also a possibility as has terrible trouble with concentration, angry temper tantrums, silliness, difficulty with sleeping and so on. Emotionally functioning at 4.5 years although just turned 8yrs, he is struggling socially and emotionally at school, mostly compliant there apart from a few big wobblers, angry and aggressive with us before he is even off school premises. He does not trust them to keep him safe.
Pre assessment Camhs seemed to think we are looking at a diagnosis of attachment disorder with neurological development problems, i.e. developmental trauma. We have been a bit concerned that as an adopted child they would automatically default problems down to attachment. The assessment this week seemed to be centred on his cognitive development, we haven’t had chance to discuss the results yet with the psych, but the therapist has told us the psych cannot believe school is not seeing any problems. The only thing Bert would say about the assessment was they asked a lot of questions and he didn’t like being timed because he didn’t finish any of the tasks within the time allowed, just like at school. A consultant from camhs at gosh saw him during a research project last year and asked how he was getting on with his SaLT ,he has never seen one, speech was delayed but meeting milestones by year 1, his pronunciations were causing difficulties with use of phonics. Gosh consult. had concerns particularly with Bert’s comprehension, how he couldn’t follow simple instructions, also saw traits of ADD,ODD, ASD
Sorry for the long post, clearly there is a lot more going on than I can post about here, but what I would like to know is what the next steps would usually be following on from the clinical psychologist assessment? So far everyone working with him now sees him as brigh,t but he struggles to do homework, he says his head is fizzing and it is always a battle. School says he doesn’t listen, but therapist says he listens to everything due to hyper vigilance so has difficulty filtering out what is important. The camhs specialist therapist had agreed it was a good idea to get Bert assessed for ADHD back in September, does anyone know if the psychologist would be able to diagnose this or would we then need to be referred on to a psychiatrist. We have completed Connors style forms during the research at Gosh camhs, but not at our local camhs. We have been chasing help for Bert since he was 3yrs and just feeling a bit overwhelmed right now. Desperate to move forward so any thoughts or advice would be appreciated.
Thanks for reading
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Post by ham on Nov 15, 2013 16:55:23 GMT
WHat a lot you have going on.DO the school see it as a failure if they admit there are concerns for Bert? You could mask to see his school records -apply in writing to see if they are recording things they are not telling you.
There is nothing to stop you visiting other school to make an informed choice, You might not have a formal diagnosis but you know your son and what will /won't work for him.
YOu don't say if he has a statement but you can apply to the LA for an assessment for a statement as you have a lot of evidence from professionals which would help.This would open up the choice of special school for you. ask the local professional if they would recommend a suitable school
good luck
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Post by smileycat on Nov 15, 2013 19:43:22 GMT
Hello there Bagpuss,
I'm sorry I can't help at all but I just wanted to say best of luck and I hope very much that you get supported very soon.
It's obv that Bert has a super Mummy.
Hugs,
SC x
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Post by sooz on Nov 15, 2013 20:39:04 GMT
Wow. Lots going on.
My ds is pretty similar, same school year, same issues and no dx.
My ds shows most of his problems at school, so, have had a whole load of support from senco. Getting post adoption support really helped get the ball rolling and sw worked with the school in getting a statement. Sw also helped me get dla.
I think school getting the brunt of behaviour really helped, is there any way you could video behaviours you are getting as evidence?
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Post by jollymummy on Nov 15, 2013 20:40:42 GMT
A psychologist can do an assessment for ADHD. I suppose if the school are saying there is nothing wrong then it would be hard to see an Ed Psych. It's odd that the school are being so resistant, despite evidence from other professionals.
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Post by pluto on Nov 15, 2013 21:15:04 GMT
As this goes on for many years already you should consider getting him privately assessed. At least to get answers for yourself. Not a lot of children have true attachment disorder, often it is just a symptome of asd, fasd, ptsd etc.
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Post by leo on Nov 15, 2013 21:24:46 GMT
Oh Bagpuss, I can feel your frustration and helplessness; so much going on for you and Bert.
ADHD is a medical diagnosis so can be made by any Doctor (usually Paedriatrician in our LA), it doesn't need to be through a Psychologist or Psychiatrist. If you've already done a Connors Assessment then what has happened to that? Who analysed it and what conclusions were drawn?
You don't need any official diagnosis in order to get a Statement - and the fact you have other professionals already involved would stand you in good stead if you applied for one. The school do not need to be supportive of this and you can apply direct to the LA.
It sounds as if the school are completely failing him and that can't be helpful to your sanity at home. My two were also in a school that didn't want to recognise their problems, we moved school and the difference is so marked that I wish I had moved them much earlier! Having a school who are willing to accept that they may not 'see' all the problems in the classroom and who are willing to listen to advice from other professionals has been so significant in helping us move forward. I know he only has two terms left in this school but is it worth considering a move? You don't need a diagnosis for a 'good' school to recognise Bert's difficulties and provide him with appropriate support.
I hope you get some positive support for Bert soon.
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Post by bagpuss72 on Nov 17, 2013 12:34:59 GMT
Thank you to all of you for your thoughts and kind words on this. I know people have worse things to deal with but the constant battles with school on top of everything else just wear you down. Ham-We had a meeting October with his teacher/senco, together with our PASW, Theraplay Therapist, also specialist for Camhs. It definitely made school look like they are failing Bert because they are, and now others are involved they are try to cover their ar*es. At the meeting Camhs voiced concern and surprise that school are still refusing to give him an IEP, at the very least he should have one in place for his visual impairment. They wanted to know if they were applying for a statement and insisting that the Ed Pysch should be involved. Bert has been on school action plus since Reception, however at a previous meeting with Yr 1 teacher, the Head, and our then PASW, we were told that Bert was on school action plus at the expense of children with real special educational needs. I wanted to change school straight away but PA SW was dead against at it due to the impact of change on Bert. We now know that reports from OT, VI team and Hospital have just been filed unread. There was a light bulb moment for the Senco when she met me and realised that I was the mum of Bert, the child whose professional reports she had been filing since pre-school, no further action. Everyone except school now agrees we need to get Bert moved and settled ASAP. Back in the summer his theraplay SW noticed the huge difference and improvement in Bert’s moods, anxiety levels and ability to cope at sessions when he had come straight from home rather than been at school. This has been a turning point for us in dealing with school issues. We have been looking at schools but the one we want Bert to attend, recommended by other adopters and our SW is heavily oversubscribed. It is mainstream but has a wonderful senco, who gets attachment. They are getting lots of enquiries from parents of kids with SEN who are not getting what they need from other local schools, which have good Ofsted reports but are target driven. They were at great pains to tell us they are not a special needs school,but we know they do have a reputation for dealing with speech and Language issues. We also know a yr 2 child from Bert’s school has been just been refused a place there, he has ADHD Dyspraxia & ASD. I have seen how Bert’s school deal with him and they have not got a clue. Have also looked at some under achieving schools with better mix of abilities and backgrounds; however Bert’s foster mum regularly has foster children in these schools so not keen to add that to the mix as well right now. Sooz- school did ask for us to video Bert in Reception to prove our concerns but we were advised against this by PAS. I wish we could invite them around to enjoy the weekend we are having right now. JollyMummy- Senco promised to involve and get an appointment with the ed pysch for Bert at last meeting. I filled in a comprehensive form but when I asked her what was happening, again she said there were other kids needing help ahead of Bert. His teacher does not like it that we have involved other professionals therefore undermining her experience and capabilities. It is not just us she has problems with, Bert’s friends sibling was in her class for 2 years, his mum constantly voicing concerns about his lack of progress, Senco insisted there were no problems; he was at middle school 4 weeks when mum was called in and asked “did you know your child has serious learning difficulties?” Pluto-we do not believe it is all down to attachment, his former neonatal paed. and our original pasw always thought Bert had ASD or FAE. If we get no further after psychologist findings, we are going to get a private assessment done. Just hard to know who to go to, do we chose a specialist in FAS or ASD. Hope the psych will be able to give us a better idea wher to start looking. Many thanks again to all that took the time to reply, it really helped offloading to those who understand  BagpussX |
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Post by jollymummy on Nov 17, 2013 14:45:32 GMT
I am fairly certain that you get priority in terms of waiting lists at a school as Bert is adopted. So it is worth putting his name down and ensuring they know he is an adopted child - your PASW should be able to advise you. I would also suggest that you write to the Chair of Governers advising them that although lots of professionals have been providing reports stating that Bert has particular needs, the school have not read them, let alone acted on them! It is so hard having to fight for everything that your child should get!!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2013 14:49:23 GMT
Have you tried Parent Partnership in your area? They can advise you on how to get your child in to your school of choice.
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Post by bagpuss72 on Nov 17, 2013 14:50:53 GMT
Thanks Guys that is very helpful
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Post by justbserene11 on Nov 17, 2013 20:14:20 GMT
I would mention (as has been said) that he is adopted. The law changed as of September this year, that any adopted child has a priority in regards to any school place.....come April 2014 our children will have a PP. I am a teacher myself and hearing you read that his school is basically 'refusing' to listen to PAS etc, I think maybe there is no point 'flogging a dead horse'?. You could write a letter to the HT and the governors (as they will have to respond to it) and note your concerns.....remember, OFSTED will always monitor LAC (and now adopted children) so it might make them pull there socks up? A very difficult thing and l am sorry that you LO is not getting the support he needs AND deserves xx
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Post by bagpuss72 on Nov 17, 2013 20:56:06 GMT
Thanks b11, flogging a dead horse is the phrase we use regularly in this house re school. I know Bert gets priority when moving to middle school in September 2015, but wasn’t sure if it applied to waiting lists for moves during the year. When I spoke to preferred school about transferring a year 3 child, they said that they do not accept transfers in such a crucial year unless moving into area! Then I played the adoption card and that’s when we were told they are not a special needs school, fine we are not looking for one, we want Bert in a year 3 not mixed 3 & 4 class. They only have one year 3 class currently with 32 pupils and a long waiting list. I will try Parent Partnership this week as JMK suggested.
I have already mentioned to the Head about the wonderful news that Pupil Premium will apply to former LAC like Bert from April. They seem to spend more money on new cabinets than pupil support. I have noticed that other schools have a clear explanation of how the PP is currently used, can’t seem to find the information on Bert’s school website. Feeling mischievous, may ask the question at the school office, knowing it will be filtered straight to the Head.
We had Ofsted in last year and I felt unable to give honest feedback comments because it would have been obvious who the confidential comments had come from. I am kicking myself now.
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Post by justbserene11 on Nov 17, 2013 21:19:11 GMT
You have done everything. I am just so sorry that your LO is not getting the support he needs or deserves. This happened at my last place of employment....who bent the rules (with students with statements) with the support they needed/deserved. I am sure l have read recently that once you have 'exhausted' everything then you can complain to the LEA/OFSTED still (maybe someone can enlighten what thread this was, as I can't remember now). I personally think, that as the laws etc have changed (and will change come April for PP) that prior LAC will be the focus (possibly) of a OFSTED/HMI, just a thought. I think the school you like, is trying to skirt around your request...the law changed, so your LO will have a priority placement now. Have you contacted the LEA of the school you wish to transfer to? I hope I have helped somewhat xx  |
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Post by bagpuss72 on Nov 17, 2013 21:38:21 GMT
Thanks b11,that is helpful.School is still in our LEA and PASW has said they will get involved liaising with the education department if need be.
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