Making sense of difficult behaviour - splitting?

No advice but a hug from me

This upsets me too. Both of mine do it & I struggle to be an adult about it.

You poor thing, he is really pushing at you isn't he! You must be exhausted and feeling terribly hurt - and I'm not surprised.

Forgive yourself. We all make mistakes and some of them are whoppers - but it's about how we repair those mistakes and what we learn from them; and the first part is to forgive yourself.

As a single parent, I only get short bursts of this type of rejection when we are with other people - and I find that hard enough to deal with!

First thought; Daddy needs to step up and show Kipper that you are loved and you are an integral part of the family. If Kipper is rude to you or rejects you then Daddy needs to come over to you and give you a hug, saying something like 'That must be hurtful to hear Kipper say that when I know how much you love him and how much you do for him. I'm sad that Kipper isn't able to show you he loves you too at the moment so I'll do it for him and maybe he'll learn it's not scary and we can all be together - we can both love him and he can love both of us'. Kipper needs to hear and see this unconditional support and love for you whilst still experiencing it for himself from you and Daddy so that he can begin to feel brave enough to risk lowering this extreme level of control. (You feel like a right wally saying this kind of thing out loud but verbalising it can really help both them and you.)

Some other thoughts:
- would making a daily timetable help? Not just to show the different parts of the day when each adult is around but also to break it down into some activities and tasks (washing, dressing, bedtime, mealtimes). You could have different pictures to show whether it was a Kipper and Mummy part of the day, a Kipper and Daddy part of the day or a Kipper's family (joint) time. How would you feel about maybe giving him some control of this? Could he maybe have three pictures of you and three of Daddy each day and choose who he wants for each task? If that feels like handing him too much control then don't even attempt it; you know your child.

- If he makes it really difficult for you to take any caring role, perhaps to start with you could be Daddy's glamorous assistant who he relies upon to have 'just the thing' he needs - and then verbalises along the lines of 'What would we do without Mummy? She always knows just what we need!' Or you could make a jokey game out of Daddy always holding your hand when he is doing something for Kipper and Daddy saying 'Mummy and you are both so important to me, I love having you both together'. Obviously many tasks are going to be extremely hard like this but maybe Kipper would respond to the silly element of this and then slowly 'allow' you to be Daddy's extra hand, then slowly swap so it is you doing the care but whilst holding Daddy's hand? Again, this gives him a lot of control but sometimes you need to play the long game and as long as you have a plan as to how to get the control and care back into your domain then it may be worth it?

- What about trying some regression? Going back to feeding him and other very early nurturing stuff. When my boys become rejecting and overly independent I take them back to this stage; sit them on my lap and feed them, rub moisture cream into their skin, snuggle in bed and read lots of stories. They can be very resistant to this! One way that works with Hurricane is for me to set a timer to go off every 20 minutes or so and tell him that every time it goes off we need to have two minutes of together time; he will start off barely tolerating this and then through the day (or weeks!) will come to actually seek this and extend it.

- Hand holding? Tough when all they are doing is desperately trying to escape from it but we do a lot of this when I can feel them 'slipping away' from me mentally and rejecting me. They have to hold my hand and come with me for whatever I'm doing; they become my other hand almost and we work as a team to complete tasks - folding the washing this way is a challenge! I think it just helps them to remember that I am there for them and reassure them that I love them and want them close despite the fact they have been biting me or spitting at me.

- What about buying Kipper a special teddy bear just from you (not Daddy) - you could then care for it in the way you really want to care for Kipper. If he will only let Daddy strap him in the car then you strap your 'Kipper Bear' in the car and give him a kiss, verbalising 'I really want to strap my real Kipper in the car but he's finding it too hard to let me be close at the moment so I'll pretend you're him' and show him how I can keep him safe and love him' Sounds bonkers - and probably is really and may not work (doesn't with my Tsunami but hugely successful with Hurricane). At times Hurricane won't let me close, I can pick up his favourite bear and tell him how hard it is to not be able to show my love properly and that I'm sad for Hurricane because it must be very scary inside. Hurricane will also engage with me in looking after the bear together - giving him a pretend wash, pretending to dress him... Hurricane will still not let me sing him a bedtime lullaby - but asks for one for his bear every night 'because it makes him feel safe Mummy'. He will also let the bear do up his shoes or his buttons or read him a story at times he wouldn't let me. He knows I am controlling the bear obviously but it seems to allow him the slight bit of distance he sometimes needs.

I am sure lots of other people with better ideas and techniques will be on soon but wanted to try and offer you support. Sorry if it's not helpful but please know I understand that pain and feeling of vulnerability. Your posts about Kipper in the past have always been so insightful into how he feels and your love for him shines through what you write.

Let yourself believe in the fact that you are a good Mother and remind yourself of all the good and right things you have done for Kipper. He does need you; he is just too scared of making himself vulnerable. Your vulnerablitity now and the pain you are feeling is what he is desperately working so hard to avoid for himself. He fears that his love for you will fail in some way or not be reciprocated so he is being defensive and not letting your love in. You will win through, he will see and feel your committment to him; stay strong, love yourself and make Daddy feel a wally by having to verbailse his love for the both of you!

Wow Sockthing that sounds so hard.

It's not uncommon however for us Mums to be rejected/treated this way. Leo has given some fantastic advice already. DH has got to show you affection and that you are important, to show Kipper that mums deserve kindness too, by verbalising why mummy needs love and people to be nice to her, hold her hand etc.

Am surprised that CAMHS haven't given you any strategies in how to deal with this rejection, because "not all children do that".

Follow Leo's advice and you can't go wrong, and try not to take it personally, it is not anything that you are doing, just Kippers way of dealing with stuff.

You've had fantastic advice so won't repeat - I was going to saying something along the lines of Mayans comments. When middly was at his controlling worst it was invariably me whom he aimed his venom at - verbally and physically. Makes sense really as it's generally the mother figure who's let them down or abandoned them (in their eyes) and so clearly mums can't be trusted to keep them safe. Dads are stronger. My son wasn't quite the same as your boy because he's always - oddly enough - always been a mummy's boy but he had to learn to trust, learn that I was strong enough to keep him safe - and when my husband kept stepping in at points of violence it wasn't helping engender trust. We got there but it involved lots of slaps, kicks, and a fair amount of saliva.

Thank all. I really appreciate all your replies and the virtual hugs.

I meant to reply this morning but PASW came and stayed quite a long time.

I agree the key is to find specific ways to reconnect, which is quite a challenge - I bought him some glow in the dark stickers recently and On Sunday I got them out to be a nice activity to do together as a way of connecting, but he refused to let me join in and it ended up daddy and K putting them up together, and I wasn't even allowed to go and look!!

Many of the things suggested just won't work I don't think, as when he is like this there's no way he would let me hold his hand around the house (he would be funny about that anyway) enforce a cuddle or physical contact, or, tbh, even play with him. It's totally his terms. He tries to stop me being in the same room as him. By the end of Sunday I realised I had had almost no physical contact with him all day, and was pining for his warm little body, however fleeting and wriggly!

And to be fair to kipper, it's not just him - after he's pushed me away so repetitively I just get so hurt that I cannot engage with him.

On reflection, I think this recent regression is partly about him staying on at nursery for lunches. We've handled it very gently, I've come in and sat with him at the table to practice several times, and he's allowed a packed lunch instead of nursery food (as he's very anxious about new food) but I think he's been more worried about it then I realised.

But It's also about a total love affair with daddy. I don't think he has an instinctive understanding of what mummies role really is. You know those new mums that are totally in love with their babies and baby and mum are really absorbed and flirtatious with each other? That's Kipper and daddy.

I put a "paper kiss" in his lunch box for nursery to help him be brave, and I asked him this afternoon if he had found his paper kiss, to which he said yes...I said "oh goody did you like it?" "Yes!" Me:" oh how nice, do you know who put it there?" And he said "yes! daddy!" And gave a lovely happy smile - it wasn't about splitting this time, it really hadn't occurred to him that it was me, even though he knew I had made his lunch and shown him where I had put his sandwiches in his new lunch box. It's like daddy is his mummy and his perceptions of what mummies are is different to other children..

Sorry, rambling again. Thanks for the support, it helps.

Thanks cowgirl. And hugs back as I could relate to much in your recent thread. I meant to respond but got bogged down.

Sounds really, really hard. I had about 9 months of this when Monkey Boy first moved in and it has gradually got easier since then (he used to scream when I walked in the room). I absolutely relate to your feeling of hurt. I keep on wanting to say 'have you tried.....', but I'm sure you have. All the same, have you tried love bombing? Have you tried tickle games? (I play chase with MB the tickle him when I catch him. I also pick him up, spin him round, chuck him on the bed and tickle him. He LOVES rough and tumble play and it has allowed me to get close and gradually get more cuddly with him). Have you tried Theraplay games? What about identifying something that he absolutely loves doing and that becoming your 'thing' that you do with him regularly. DH and I tried all these things to 're-set' MBs relationship with me. It has made a huge difference. Things aren't 'fixed' completely, but are soooooo much better.

P.s JMK , yes I was surprised by CAMHS too, and disappointed! Not going to let it lie though to be fair it was towards the end of the session and they were running late so perhaps she felt it would be better discussed another day. Who knows.

Thank you for your input pear tree, it's always respected and listened to! 

That's an interesting perspective actually because I remember that I wondered before about whether it was less an active rejection of mummy and maybe more about a need to keep daddy close. Daddy is definitely his primary attachment. 

I seem to remember reading something somewhere about children with attachment issues excluding the care of other adults as a way of reassuring themselves about the primary attachment, and as a way of preserving it and keeping it safe. Does anyone know where I may have read this?? It would also explain why when we have visitors - secondary attachment figures like grandparents - If daddy is not here then Kipper insists that I do everything however minor , the same exclusion tactic but on them. It feels like a way of ensuring I am closest in the pack. It has made bonding hard for the grandparents (we are 3 years in and he still won't let them put his shoes on etc). 

I am disappointed in CAMHS because it is a CAMHS LAAC team and I had hoped they would be very in tune with the signs of attachment problems. They are not disputing attachment problems but I wonder if compared with many other adoptive families we seem less "severe" in our problems. Also, to be fair it's early days , we've only had 2 appointments. 

I absolutely agree with you about fear of abandonment, and I believe this is why we have had such terrible bedtimes and now such persistent night-waking. I was up in the night with Kipper for an hour last night, and he actually said to me , in a worried voice" but mummy when you go to sleep I am alone".   He can't tell us any clearer than that!!!

CAMHS are not hearing this either - they say he wakes in the night because he falls asleep in our bed and then we move him to his - and therefore his sleep associations are all wrong. I accept this may be part of the picture but it does not allow for the fact that he was night waking before we started settling him in our bed, and also does not take into account the terrible trouble we have combatting separation anxiety, and the almost constant need for attention at home. 

No one is listening to me - we went to the paediatrician yesterday and he has backtracked amazingly fast about the ASD - he now seems primarily concerned that kipper isn't holding his pencil in a tripod grip!!! He won't remove the dx of social comm difficulties because he acknowledges "something"   - and I am glad about that - but he will not discuss with me the things I am concerned about - the stuff I just mentioned here. 

So it feels like between them no one is hearing me. In the meantime the paediatrician is tutting at me about "why is Kipper not at full time nursery?" ( he only does 2 mornings a week plus lunch) , and the amount everyone expects me to sign up to is ridiculous - adoption parenting courses, autism parenting courses, OT, Portage, Theraplay, social skills. Meanwhile DH is telling me to "take the intensity down a few notches" - in fact , he is right but how hard to do when I am carrying all the responsibility for the above. It's no wonder I feel I've got blocked-empathy. 

I do apologise for another long post in my own thread , I'm sure it seems very ego-centric, but I think if I didn't have this place just to Express myself to people I would crumble eventually!